A bit Controversial but can see their point....

MarieMc85 wrote:I don't think that breast augmentation should be available on the NHS apart from for cancer sufferers who have had a breast or breasts removed.

I don't understand why the need for someone having had a breast removed causing severe assymetry should be greater than that of a woman born with the same deformity though, afterall, for neither the cancer sufferer or the woman born with a deformity the surgery is not life saving.

There are people who have cancer, Parkinsons, Alzheimers etc who are suffering as the NHS cannot provide vital medication to prolong and enrich their lives.

I think it's disgusting that people are denied life saving drugs Marie, I also think it's disgusting that our politicians spent our hard earned taxes intended for things like that on themselves funding the most ludicrous excuses for expenses! and that the government allow our banks to pay such ridiculous bonuses to the fat cats!

I agree Tinks it should all be down to individual assessment unfortunately the people in PCT's making funding decisions aren't those dealing with patients so it's easy to say no. The long term cost is most definately the biggest problem as NICE and PCT's are dealing with funding for now and are under pressure to spend less but no one gets any praise for reducing the consequences that might happen ten years down the line.
I do agree with gastric banding on the NHS for some people in some circumstances (as I do for ba) the long term cost of someone who is morbidly obese as opposed to a few stone overweight is huuuuge! (no pun intended)
Gastric banding is not something which the NHS do lightly due to the risks involved but I feel it is a little different to ba as weight loss surgery can be life saving.

A bit of a side line topic but I dont think addicts of any kind should be denied life saving transplants. Addicts are people too and addiction is not a lifestyle choice. The life of an addict is not worth less than the life of anyone else.

[quote="cookie"]

MarieMc85 wrote:I don't think that breast augmentation should be available on the NHS apart from for cancer sufferers who have had a breast or breasts removed.

I don't understand why the need for someone having had a breast removed causing severe assymetry should be greater than that of a woman born with the same deformity though, afterall, for neither the cancer sufferer or the woman born with a deformity the surgery is not life saving.[quote]

I agree with you there Cookie, something I missed out on my original post. I've seen girls on Embarrassing Bodies that have had one A cup boob and one D cup boob for example and agree they should have corrective surgery as anyone with a "deformity" should.

BUT having boobs you consider to be "too small" is not a deformity.

I'd love liposuction to be slimmer but I don't expect the NHS to fund that!

xxx

lucyt wrote:A bit of a side line topic but I dont think addicts of any kind should be denied life saving transplants. Addicts are people too and addiction is not a lifestyle choice. The life of an addict is not worth less than the life of anyone else.

I disagree, being a drug or alcohol addict is a lifestyle choice. No one forced them to take drugs or drink to excess, it is widely known that these things are bad for you and addictive.

Also, they should show that they are sober and clean before they are allowed any form of transplant. Look at George Best, that was disgusting.

I do not feel there is a problem with providing BA's for people on the NHS, but like everything in this country if something is free, you will always get those people who abuse the system. I think this is what annoys people more than anything else, the people who do nothing, pay nothing and get everything for free, while mugs go to work to pay taxes to get less than those that do F all.

I have to say that I agree with Marie. Over the years the NHS has changed with society and adapted to what people expect from the service after paying their taxes. But, in the beginning, when the NHS was first introduced, this was absolutely not what it was meant for. The country is practically on its knees financially and people are having to go without. In my opinion any non-urgent surgery apart from reconstructive surgery following an accident or cancer treatment should be put on the back-burner until we are in a better financial position. The reason I think reconstructive surgery to correct asymmetry should still be allowed is because someone's breast will actually have been REMOVED in order to cure them rather than someone having to have to adjust to having asymmetrical breasts from an early age. To have a part of your body actually removed must be a severely traumatic experience and I think people that have been through the gruelling rounds of chemo and the awful experience that is cancer should be allowed to attempt to get back to normal life with surgery at no expense.

I'm not saying that people with uneven breasts do not go through emotional problems like cancer survivors, they obviously do, but I just don't think the money is there to treat everyone who has this problem and not cause problems for other areas of the NHS - there has to be a limit somewhere. And in an ideal world they should have the surgery available to them. But, we all were obviously very unhappy with our breasts otherwise we wouldn't have chosen to put ourselves through major surgery and fork out all that money - surely if we could demonstrate to the NHS that it affected our daily lives and caused us enough emotional upset (which it most probably did in most cases) we should all be entitled to the surgery on the NHS - and that would never work! There isn't the cash!

Like Marie, I would be devastated if I'd had my surgery on the NHS and later found out that someone in my trust had died of cancer or some other awful disease because the trust didn't have enough money to fund the drugs, or that an alzheimer's patient had to suffer rapid deterioration because the drugs weren't available.

People do know it's addictive that's true but not everyone who drinks alcohol will become an addict. Some people have an addictive personality and become addicted to a substance without choosing to. Drug addicts can be forced into that position by either other people or circumstances of life that many of us are lucky enough not to endure.

Hmmm i cant really decide if im being biased because i had to get the money together for my own surgery, or if i genuinly think its abit selfish for someone with small boobs to get a boob job for free using other peoples taxes and wasting NHS money.

Either way i do believe if theres a deformity its a bit different because there are thousands and thousands of girls with just small boobs and theyre not seen as 'weird' but severe assymerty etc is ALOT more rare and i can imagine things like that could cause alot of psychological harm because you would feel so different and abnormal. I had tiny tiny boobs and i did hate them but i think if id have had a deformity i would have been soooo much more bothered by them.

xxx

I suppose having a severe deformity would impact your daily life so much and in that respect I guess it would be right to have something like that rectified on the NHS.

lucyt wrote:People do know it's addictive that's true but not everyone who drinks alcohol will become an addict. Some people have an addictive personality and become addicted to a substance without choosing to. Drug addicts can be forced into that position by either other people or circumstances of life that many of us are lucky enough not to endure.

I know that but alcoholics are obviously drinking to excess.

There are reasons why people become addicted to drink and drugs. I'm saying they should prove that they are clean before they get a transplant. A lot of people go back to their old habits once they have a new healthy body to get back out into the real world with! The reason they haven't been drinking or taking drugs before the transplant is because they've been laid up in a hospital bed too ill to do anything!

Jessica wrote:In my opinion any non-urgent surgery apart from reconstructive surgery following an accident or cancer treatment should be put on the back-burner until we are in a better financial position. The reason I think reconstructive surgery to correct asymmetry should still be allowed is because someone's breast will actually have been REMOVED in order to cure them rather than someone having to have to adjust to having asymmetrical breasts from an early age.

Can you adjust to having severe assymetry? Can a cancer patient adjust to having their breast removed after having life saving treatment?

To have a severe breast deformity that effects your life and well being whether it's due to removal or nature must be traumatic for any woman. xx

misf1 wrote:I do not feel there is a problem with providing BA's for people on the NHS, but like everything in this country if something is free, you will always get those people who abuse the system. I think this is what annoys people more than anything else, the people who do nothing, pay nothing and get everything for free, while mugs go to work to pay taxes to get less than those that do F all.

I agree. xx

Jessica wrote:I suppose having a severe deformity would impact your daily life so much and in that respect I guess it would be right to have something like that rectified on the NHS.

Just seen this after I responded to your last post Jessica. :good: xx

I agree that to correct these types of things is the right thing to do - I just don't think the NHS has the money right now to do it successfully. xx

OK, this is going to be very controversial.

Cancer is a horrible, horrible, horrible disease, and I donate to cancer research because I feel so strongly about how awful the disease is.

Having breast cancer must be horrendous, absolutely devastating for the women who get it. With luck, they will survive the disease. A terrible side affect of this disease is they are then left with one or both breasts removed.

They no longer feel feminine because a part of them that identifies them as a woman has been taken away.

Now put yourself in the position of a woman who has a chest like a man. Not small boobs - no boobs at all. OK, she has not had to put up with the terrible disease. They did not have to have the gruelling treatment. She does however, feel unfeminine. She has never had boobs. She has lived for her adult life feeling inadequate and unsexy. Never feeling like a proper woman.

I believe some women should have boob jobs on the NHS. I believe that if you are in a position to pay yourself, you should.

Maria
xxx

OMG loving this thread and it is controversial so heres a couple of things to add

Obesity : I have worked as fitness instructor/group fitness/personal club trainer for 19 years. I have saw many 'obese' people pretend they are eating healthy and exercising but really not trying hard enough. When they put the work in, they lose the weight HOWEVER I have also over the years saw people who really really do try and struggle with weight loss. There is a fat Gene and its been proven. So what makes it easy for one to lose weight doesn't mean it is for another. So gastric band surgery on the NHS - yes I think it should be allowed once all other avenues have been addressed.

Fertility treatment - I had it for my 2 kids on the NHS. I came across the whole why should some people pay and some get it on the nhs. Should it be funded by the nhs to help people have a child when its not life threatening. It was and still is a postcode lottery on what treatment you are offered. (This is wrong as it should be offered the same wherever you live. ) However - 'If you want something enough you should save for it' Well its not easy for everyone to save whether it be a boob job, gastric band or fertility treatment. Not everyone should be branded under the same umbrella. Depression is a horrible illness and very misunderstood. If something causes someone to have it whether it be failure to conceive, no confidence because they are flat chested like a man, obese despite trying their best to lose weight then why should they not at least have a chance on the NHS.

Yes this is controversial and everyone has their own opinions so its fantastic on this site how everyone here can say what they feel without being frowned upon and show respect to one another despite a difference of opinion
Love Dimple Dee

lucyt wrote:A bit of a side line topic but I dont think addicts of any kind should be denied life saving transplants. Addicts are people too and addiction is not a lifestyle choice. The life of an addict is not worth less than the life of anyone else.

I agree, although it depends on the level of their addiction. Like alcoholics, i think they should have to be making steps to come off and stay off, otherwise the organ could be better given to someone whod take better care of it.

Hi, just thought I would chip in as I myself have had a breast augmentation on the NHS. I didn’t have small breasts to start with, or even very small breasts; I literally didn’t have a centimetre of breast tissue develop when I went through puberty. Although I started my periods early and developed generous hips and bum my chest looked like that of a 10 year old boy. It was an utterly miserable, lonely experience and I needed to wear a gel bra stuffed with chicken fillets every day to even look like an aa cup.

If I had even had small breasts I would’ve been delighted to look like a normal person, and indeed the operation I had on the NHS only took me to a 32b, which some girls consider ‘flat chested’ and a lot of girls who have breast enlargements are this size to start with! But I was incredibly happy to just finally look normal and not be ashamed of my body, and I do not have a shred of guilt about using the NHS to fund the operation.

I don’t agree that girls who are simply small chested and want to enhance what they have should be granted an BA through the NHS, as although some girls might not like the appearance of aa or a cup breasts, they are completely natural, but then again I’ve never actually heard of the NHS granting BA’s for just being small breasted. I also don’t agree with women approaching the NHS for a boob job after having children and experiencing a change in appearance and volume of their breasts, because although they may not like the physical effects of childbirth, they are completely natural and a direct result of having children which is their choice.

I understand that the screening process for BA’s through the NHS is very strict and rightly so, only operating in the cases of absent breast, tubular breasts, severe asymmetry or reconstruction and in my opinion having any of these conditions is extremely debilitating in a way that I cannot even articulate into words, and worthy of seeking treatment through the NHS.

I like this thread, it is very interesting.

I think reconstruction and severe deformity of breasts should be on the nhs. I dont think a normal BA should, i do however think that counselling should be available for so many sessions everywhere (this is also a postcode lottery), if more counselling were available we may be able to prevent some of these surgeries, afterall many of the symptoms recognised are not the root of the problem, people become alcoholics for a reason, as with drug addicts and often obesity. Excessive drinking or taking drugs could be a symptom of being depressed (self medication), or redundancy could cause homelessness causing alcoholism (this isnt a given, just a hypathetical example).

I do get concerned that the NHS is running out of money and some people are not able to get the treatment they need. I do believe to some degree that some of these things could be prevented, but when it comes to mental health it is very complicated, and easy to judge.

I have autoimmune under active thyroid, and i regularly need to get blood tests and get my medication free because i have to take it every day for the rest of my life (This wasnt as a result of my lifestyle and is rare in someone my age). This i am very thankful for, i would rather save up or get a loan for my BA than risk not having the support for my thyroid disorder. xx

Vix wrote:I have autoimmune under active thyroid, and i regularly need to get blood tests and get my medication free because i have to take it every day for the rest of my life (This wasnt as a result of my lifestyle and is rare in someone my age). This i am very thankful for, i would rather save up or get a loan for my BA than risk not having the support for my thyroid disorder. xx

I too have an autoimmune disorder, as well as rheumatoid arthritis (Had both for 20 years) and am also on meds for the rest of my life, unfortunately my illness isn't covered for free meds so I have to pay for mine for the rest of my life. Again, not a lifestyle choice and I have to buy pre-payment certificates costing £104 a year, doesn't seem fair does it that we both have an illness that effects us for the rest of our lives and yet one gets treated for free and the other doesn't. I've never understood that one. xxx

Hi Cookie,

That does seem strange, i wonder why. Im sorry i dont know much about yours, i know with mine if i dont take my medication my metabolism will slow so much that my organs will fail and would eventually die, is yours a similar thing? If not maybe its because it is ultimately life threatening.

It does seem odd that something so similar doesnt get the same benefits xx

Vix wrote:Hi Cookie,

That does seem strange, i wonder why. Im sorry i dont know much about yours, i know with mine if i dont take my medication my metabolism will slow so much that my organs will fail and would eventually die, is yours a similar thing? If not maybe its because it is ultimately life threatening.

It does seem odd that something so similar doesnt get the same benefits xx

Yeah, same deal. I need daily steroids and a weekly injection just to keep me mobile and to control the damage to my lungs, without them the condition would be life threatening.

My dad had thyroid problems too so I was aware the scipts for people with thyroid issues were free, they're also free if you have diabetes or epilepsy, but there are so many long term life threatening conditions that arent covered. xx

That does sound the same, i am suprised. When i was diagnosed i didnt expect mine to be free, but i am very grateful it is. Seems wrong yours isnt the same. But this is it, not everything is equal at the moment, and very debateable. Questionably some who get the treatment/benefits etc (generlising here), dont always need it as much as others. I wouldnt be happy if i had to pay but i am sure there are those more in need than me who deserve it. Besides this though, i hardly go to the doctor and havent been to hospital (besides BA). I try to look after myself but othes arnt always able to. (sorry going off on one, this is a very interesting thread!) xx

Well this is a great topic & well done to all the girls for keeping it nice! lol

Soooooo heres what i think..............I was one if the girls who had a chest like a man with nooooo boobs at all!.
I went years not being able to aford breast surgury & couldnt pluck up the guts to go to my g.p as to me i thought it was being selfish asking for breast surgury when you have people like my dad who have canser a medical problem.

I finally sat down & asked my dad who has had canser twice at at the age of 32 & the 5 years later.

I told him how i felt & that i felt it was almost taking the mick to go to the G.p & ask him to help me with something 'cosmetic' when my dad was sitting there with No testicals after having two different types of Testicular canser ( soooo unlucky bless him!)

He told me that i shouldnt feel this way as i have no breasts & thats just not natural in his eyes for a women just like him having no testicals & the NHS offered to give him surgury to fix it for him but he turned it down as he said it didnt effect his confidence one little bit............ yes i didnt have canser like him but i didnt have breasts.........he said we both dont have something we both should have wether we were born like it or canser took it away & that the nhs offer correction surgury so why shouldnt i take it up as it badly effected me.

I agree that girls should have B.A on the NHS as having No breasts or deformed breast is something thats no normal & should be corrected if it effects the persons life.

I went to my G.P & he was totally understanding & said that he would refere me as i had what he classed as no breasts & should be intitaled to have a correction on the NHS but once i had a actual doctor say it was not normal i couldnt wait any longer & my dad lent my hubby the money for my surgury.

I think having canser & lossing your breasts is very, very hard but so is being a women born with abnormal breasts.

x

What a fantastic thread!

I had tubular breasts so suppose they would be classed as abnormal?! I never ever thought of considering asking my GP to refer me as I thought I would have been rejected but I wish I had now if it would have saved me £4.5k, I have paid tax and NI since starting working full time at 17 so why should I not get something back, government seems to dish out to everyone else.

Mind you saying that we ended up paying private for our daughters grommets because she was in constant and discomfort yet we were told it would take at least 4 months before she would get a referal for treatment on the NHS so maybe my postcode is unlucky x